Feb 13 2006
Tachyon Energy for the Masses
Browsing the Web the other day, I came upon several websites that sell products that supposedly harness the power of… tachyon energy. These products include “tachyon-infused” silica disks, beads, crystals, elbow wraps, blankets, bottled water, and of course massage oils and body lotions. 
Suspending disbelief for a moment, I explored the websites hoping to discover the secret behind the process of Tachyonization. The discovery of tachyons itself, not to mention being able to control them at room temperature, surely deserves worldwide attention! I have no idea why any of these companies hasn’t gone public with their discovery. No idea at all! So let’s begin.
The last time I checked, a tachyon is a hypothetical particle that is one of the byproducts of special relativity. Recall that Einstein’s famous relation
yields both real and imaginary solutions. The real solutions apply to real-world physical particles, that is, particles that travel slower than the speed of light. The imaginary solutions arise when we invent a particle that has a velocity (v) greater than the speed of light (c). Since Einstein’s equation permits this kind of solution, there’s nothing stopping us from imagining such a particle.
The thing to remember, however, is that just because the equation allows such solutions does not automatically imply that such particles actually exist. In fact, the existence of tachyons would present significant problems for physics as we know it, since their interaction with normal matter (if it’s allowed) would violate the laws of causality, since any matter or information traveling faster than light must also travel backwards in time.
Apparently, what the naïve mainstream physicists fail to realize is that there’s a ton of money to be made from selling New Age products that claim to harness the True Power of tachyons!
A company called Advanced Tachyon Technologies (no joke!), has been marketing such products, which include glass beads for $50 that “have been proven to be the most effective directional antennas for the localized clearing of blockages in the Energetic Continuum.” The company peddles its products through a multi-level marketing scheme (MLM), where various distributors organize their own websites and sell the products on behalf of the parent company. Examples of these sites are here, here, and here.
So what exactly is this “tachyon energy” they speak of? The ATT website attempts to explain this, but I’ll spare you the mind-numbing pseudoscientific psycho-babble, and instead provide a short excerpt:
Tachyon Energy is the very first energetic structure that emerges out of non-structured, formless Zero-Point Energy. Just like Zero-Point Energy, Tachyon is not limited to a certain frequency. Tachyon cannot be measured in the Hertzian frequency spectrum. It is not a certain type of energy. Rather, it includes all energies within itself. Its qualities are much like Zero-Point Energy, varying only in that it is a structured field.
Very rarely have I seen this many misuses of scientific terminology in a single paragraph. What is an “energetic structure”? Why is zero-point energy “formless”? What other “frequency spectrum” is there besides the “Hertzian” one? This paragraph alone should be enough to taint our confidence in the effectiveness of the Tachyon line of products.
In another page of their website, ATT attempts to explain the “physics of tachyons.” This should be good…
The condensation of zero-point energy into tachyon energy is the beginning of the Energetic Continuum, which is directly responsible for all forms on the planet. It is this condensation that creates all forms. In the production of matter, this formless zero-point energy condenses into faster-than-light tachyon. At the point of the speed of light, tachyon interacts with the Subtle Organizing Energy Fields (SOEFs).
Once again, pure garbage. Each sentence becomes more and more devoid of meaning to anyone but the most scientifically ignorant. They proceed to give a diagram and an explanation of a tachyon interacting with other particles:
For this explanation, we will explore the interaction of tachyon energy with the lepton family of particles. The first elementary particle in the lepton family is a pion. The pion exists below the speed of light and has a consistent mathematically computable orbit, which we call the Subtle Organizing Energy Field (SOEF).
This paragraph, if anything, is the nail in the coffin, since it speaks volumes about the background of the “scientists” behind these products. A pion is indeed a known particle, but it’s by no means a lepton (it’s a meson). The family of leptons includes the electron, the muon, and the tau. (There are also three flavors of neutrinos, and all the corresponding antiparticles.)
Even if we assume that the author meant to say “tau” instead of “pion,” there is still a slew of problems. The tau is not the “first” particle in the lepton family. That would be the electron. Also, the author speaks of a “mathematically computable orbit.” Orbit around what?
It’s fairly clear that these ramblings are from a person with a high-school level grasp of physics who has taken too many issues of Popular Science too seriously. It’s highly unlikely that this person not only proved the existence of tachyons, but invented a process that alters matter at the subatomic level, allowing tachyons to be focused, thereby healing the human body of all ailments. The fact that the “inventor” of this technology hasn’t yet been invited to Stockholm for the Nobel ceremony proves this point definitively.
Speaking of the Tachyonization process, the ATT website states that the inventors would rather “keep it proprietary” instead of patenting it (I wonder why!). The website does, however, try to explain what tachyonization is not:
The Tachyonization process is not a frequency, spin manipulation, or transfer. It is not a high frequency or coil technology. It does not use magnets or sounds. It does not use sacred geometry to inform products. It is not a photon-based technology. It is not an SE-5 or other form of radionics-based technology. It does not require prayer or meditation. The technology does not use crystals or orgone technologies. It is absolutely not operator-sensitive.
Well of course it’s not any of those things. It’s not anything! Correction, it is something: it’s a cleverly-worded excuse for these companies to charge $30 for a bottle of water and $50 for a bunch of glass beads.
These companies have created the perfect recipe for sucking in highly impressionable New-Agers: throw in a bunch of the usual vague spiritual buzzwords: energy, healing, flow, balance, chakra, any of which would give an unsuspecting customer a hard-on… and combine them with the latest cool-sounding scientific jargon hijacked by the New Age movement: frequency, spectrum, continuum, fields, waves, and now, tachyons.
Combining all these words into randomized, barely coherent sentences, as ATT has done, speaks of a very naïve, superficial understanding of physics and mathematics, not to mention medicine. The only terminology that the website uses correctly is the financial and legal terminology for recruiting distributors and reeling in unsuspecting customers to pay through their noses for glass beads, silica disks, and bottled water.
Once again, tachyons are hypothetical, and not real! Even if they do “exist,” it would certainly not be possible to manipulate them. It’s not even clear what it would mean to manipulate them. Even if tachyons could be controlled, doing so would not be possible by modifying ordinary matter. And even if it were possible to control tachyons using ordinary matter, it’s absurd to assume that they would have some sort of healing effect on the human body!
My god, browsing all these sites has made my head hurt. It’s a bullshit overdose!
February 14th, 2006 at 12:59 pm
I find it curious that one of your referenced sites displays a “warning” to consumers to avoid purchasing “fake” tachyon energy products. And their advice as to how to be assured of “authenticity”?
“Distinguishing counterfeit products on the Internet was once extremely difficult because consumers couldn’t test the product, nor could they see the person from whom they were buying.” This site doesn’t happen to advertise that there is a “free trial period” or a “Tachyon Representative” that will bring these products to my door to sample.
“Many consumers who purchase “tachyon energy” products over the Internet never even receive the products they’ve paid for, and they are often unable to get their money back when they discover that the products they purchased don’t work. Identifying counterfeit (i.e., fake) “tachyon energy” products on the Internet is now extremely easy.” And how is it extremely easy, whereas before it was once “extremely difficutlt”?
“Check for the Advanced Tachyon Technologies logo.” Right. My wheels are turning. That logo has the effect of “Trust Us. Really.”
February 14th, 2006 at 1:02 pm
Oh, and do they offer a money-back guarantee if I make a claim that their product “doesn’t work”?
February 14th, 2006 at 1:51 pm
Ok Debbie Downer, I love my head band and find it’s properties very beneficial in engaging the levels of my energetic spiritual aura to unheard of heights. Not to mention, it’s reversing my ageing process. I expect to wake up at age 5 in about 48 hours. Don’t be jealous. The only thing that would boost my tachyons further would be if the headband came in some sort of day glo.
February 15th, 2006 at 11:22 am
I’m not sure I would agree that these people have no knowledge of physics… I think it’s more likely that they DO know some physics and have very carefully crafted this BS so that it contains no testable proposition. The writers of “The Simpsons” must be quite familiar with normal families in order to portray a dysfunctional one most effectively and humorously. By analogy…
August 2nd, 2007 at 12:47 pm
While I agree 100% with your assertion that “Tachyon” is entirely the wrong operational term here I do NOT agree with your purely academic notion that ATTI’s products do nothing but cost money.
A Biologist by profession I once in 1998 resorted to “Tachyon” with a severe backpain - I gave it 1% chance - at the most! but all else had already failed and there was nothing to loose. I became pain-free within 3 days and stayed that way til today. I just mention this so you get a bit down from you high theoretical horse and maybe - just maybe - become a little empirical (aka scientific) again.
there is a simple test that does not cost much and will convice you that those glas beads are not like any other glas beads:
take a petri dish of NaCl solution and let the water vaporize with such a “tachyon” glas thing underneath, have a control of the same solution ready.
Look at the cristals in both dishes with any cheap microskope.
Then come back here and let me know what you saw.
Unless you believe that simple glass has an influence on cristal organzation something else is at work, but -and here we agree- its not tachyons!
September 14th, 2007 at 7:40 pm
As a physicist I have to say that you should perform sam’s experiment a hundred times with two hundred different petri dishes. Also, you should try to use other glass beads of different sizes and composition.
Ask the ATT for a donation of a hundred glass beads to perform an experiment, and see what they say..!
Or, if they refuse, accept to buy some glass beads to perform the experiment, but specify that you will publish the results in your blog, and at least in a local newspaper. I’m pretty sure they won’t sell you anything!
September 19th, 2007 at 4:56 am
The problem with “scientists” like Dimitry and Phil are - they arn’t any.
1) They have an opinion and voice it as fact - no room is allowed for the unexpected.
2) they are smug with their world view - if e.g. a UFO would fly in their face they would deny it.
3) They are LAZY (like most humans) - however a real scientist can not afford such luxury. In the time it took to make up this blog they could NOT have falsified the tachyon claims or given any statement as to wether it works in some respects or none - its a lot of work, it costs money and takes a lot of time.
I have done all of the above and with 11 different so called tachon products on my own dime and time - because I am a scientist. You guys are just cheap talkers. and let me guess - the next thing I will read is: let us have your results (for free of course - because laziness, cheap mindset and the “it should all be for free for me” are rampant in this society)
no such luck, if you want to know you got to invest!
let me rephrase that - if you want anything worthwhile out of your lifes you got to invest!
-sam
November 14th, 2007 at 3:24 pm
I saw all that website and I almost cried. I have a degree, Im smart, I went to college and I have studied Physics in engineering.
Tachyons are not something you feel in your heart, it isn’t zero point energy. They are particles, not unlike the particles that make up Gamma radiation, or X rays. As Arnold Sommerfeld, who discovered their theoretical existence, put it, “A tachyon is a particle with space-like four-momentum and imaginary proper time. It is constrained to the space-like portion of the energy-momentum graph. Therefore, it can never slow to light speed or below.”
http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/Tachyon.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tachyon
(Gasp! I have sources and equations to describe Tachyons. )
So there are a dozen problems with “Tachyonized products.” and even more reasons why they can’t exist. Advanced Tachyon Technologies and any similar website is nothing more than a scam, and a very poor one. I don’t feel sorry for anyone stupid enough to buy their products.
Surprisingly though, they are rather popular!
So just in case anyone else felt like being stupid read on before buying “tachyonized” anything.
1, It is a type of particle not a type of energy. There are only four forces and the all apply to Tachyons just like they do to you and I. So energy is the same, it is the properties of Tachyons that are different.
2. Tachyons only go faster than light because they are described with a negative square, which means they have less than no mass, thus negative mass, thus Negative energy, thus Negative entropy.
3. That implies that if they did go slow enough to interact with mater that it would be rather explosive. Their properties would resemble anti mater.
4, Seen as they travel so fast, it is possible that they have all left the known universe many ages ago and are farther out in space than anything else and they are only going farther away.
5. It is highly doubtful that they even exist.
6. We have a base set up to detect them just incase they are somehow still produced, or that they have swung each other back in our direction. If a tachyon passes within a parsec of Earth we will have an idea. So far, we think we might have detected one… maybe. One particle, smaller than an atom. And even if we did detect one, its light years away form here now.
If we could even detect a Tachyons existence and prove it, then we could advance physics another step.
So it is a scam beyond scams when they tell you they can make products out of this stuff! Wake up! Stop being taken advantage of. If anyone could slow down a Tachyon then that implies that we could also accelerate matter to those speeds. Theoretically that would take more energy than is contained in a Billion suns. So no, we can’t. It cant go slower than light speed because to slow it down requires putting infinite energy into it.
Any feeling you get form these products is just that, a feeling. Placebos, unlike Tahyons, have been proven to exist. In that case, you had the ability to feel better all along.
These companies selling Tachyon products have done nothing but make fools out of their customers. Dont take offense. I dont think Im better than anyone, but I do study this stuff! You have all been deceived. It is Advanced Tachyon Technologies you should be mad at. And similar companies. They have re-worded fact to exploit the ignorant.
November 26th, 2007 at 2:27 pm
to Jonathan Martin:
you have studied it? you mean you have read books and papers. I HAVE STUDIED IT. I have bought it and put it to the test. that is studying. what you do is deduction.
Like all those sickening self-assured brain-nerds out there, who know-it-all-because-they-went-to-university the real life passed you by.
Just last week an aquaintance of mine with a dislocated back went thru one week of agony contemplating surgery - a tachyon rubber plate saved his day within a few hours and he swears by it now. it has nothing to do with tachyon - I already said that so its a misnomer. but it works. that part is the important part and **you** mr smartass have NO part in it.
To read shit like yours again and again makes ME cry.
November 28th, 2007 at 7:09 am
Sam, there’s no reason to resort to vulgarities. All that Mr. Martin and I want is results. We’re not interested in anecdotal stories from anyone — just verifiable, reproducible evidence from unbiased observers.
I’m assuming that the reason for your anger is that you’ve finally realized that you paid over 1000 euros for some worthless plastic trinkets.
Whether or not someone has a university education has no bearing on their critical thinking skills (but it helps). A university education can also help someone learn about things like the placebo effect, which is exactly what’s going on here.
The human body is a marvelous self-healing machine. I have no doubt that your friend’s back would have healed itself regardless of whether he had a rubber plate attached to it. To assume that the rubber plate has magical properties (for which we should pay money) is plain gullibility.
Getting back to the question of results, it seems that you’re charging a fee for viewing your test results — did I read that correctly?! What kind of scientist does that? If money is what you want, then you should apply for James Randi’s million-dollar prize. In case you’re not familiar with this, Mr. Randi offers a prize of $1000000 to anyone who can demonstrate any paranormal phenomenon under controlled conditions. The term “paranormal” is very broadly defined, and would definitely include this tachyon technology. With your energy and determination, you would make a great applicant.
January 3rd, 2008 at 10:07 pm
Thank you Dmitry,Jonathan and Phil! Tachyonized products don’t work and you’ve made that /crystal/clear. Thank you for saving my time and money!
March 21st, 2008 at 3:14 pm
Now listen, this is my final word for all you sorry excuses for intelligent life:
(and that does not go for G V - he’s not even that, he just looks for the opinion that least shatters his preconceived notions that have no basis in ANY reality - no matter what universe you live in - and that definitely is SUBHUMAN - any gorilla does it better)
You know NOTHING - all you do is DEDUCT.
I have made an elaborate and as much as possible objective test (we might all live in a matrix - how can we be objective if we create reality as we live? - but thats entirely philosophical)
and I am NOT AT ALL sorry to have spent 1000 bucks on tachyon products - I have in fact spent almost 10.000 dollars on tachyon products - but not for this test - for this test alone I did spent 1000,-. The test subjects are cristals and plants - no human had to suffer for it. it also counts out placebo.
you can read it here (if your german is as good as my english which I doubt)
http://lifescout.com/tachyontest-2/
now exuse me - I have a life to live and cant afford to waste time with idiots who use only 3% of their brain and 0% of their intuition and are nothing but cheap, sleepy and lazy cowards.
get your worldview tumbled - it really helps in waking up!
March 26th, 2008 at 12:42 am
From my experience tachyons work - I’ve tried muscle testing on several hundred people and results are 100% Get a tachyonized plate and put fruit on it (split the batch in two) - the fruits on the plate take alot longer to decay. Also, hasnt quantum mechanics proved the entire scientific method invalid? The experiment falls in line with the observers consciousness, foregone conclusions play out in what’s being observed and different groups with different intentions have different results. I say use whatever works for you. In my experience tachyonized products work, great. I believe the reason zero-point energy is formless because it’s an energy form before vibrational energy - as in our senses and instruments we have can’t detect it because it exists outside of the detectable level. I guess its the same thing as proving that we have a subconscious mind - we have all the proof in the world that it’s there, but we can’t see it. See it in action yes, all the time but where is it?
March 27th, 2008 at 3:52 pm
Interesting discussion. I totally agree with Dmitry, but I also know that I don’t know everything, so I’m still on the fence. I’ve been thinking of buying something, my health is bad so I’m always looking for any help, I’m the perfect sucker, but there’s crazy technology that I/the world just doesn’t know about yet. Maybe there’s something to this?
Sam, it sounds like you believe that tachyon in general is something real that works, did your testing confirm this? I looked up the website you mentioned but am still not sure of the final conclusion.
April 2nd, 2008 at 7:28 am
@sam:
Sorry, Sam, but it’s my website, so I get the last word. If anything, your crankiness is the ultimate proof that “tachyon” technology has no merit, since you choose to verbally abuse me and my readers instead of showing a smidgen of concrete results. Thank you for shedding such conclusive light on this issue.
April 28th, 2008 at 9:43 pm
I think that it is wonderful to believe that there is an unseen beneficial energy just waiting to be tapped (if you are privay to the rather expensive proprietary secret, that is!). Unfortunately, tachyon harnassing products have not been proven to work in a controlled objective testing environment. Until that day, I can only assume that the placebo effect is the reason for the occasional benefits attributable to it.
P.S. Sounds like someone is a bit jealous of those with college degree’s. Lighten up, and your case might be easier to grasp.
June 1st, 2008 at 4:42 pm
I read your opinion and I accept it beacause is only one opinion. The energy flows where your thin goes and you try to find problems in something new. I bought many tachyonized products from switzerland and I use it all of them and really work. For me I feel protected a lot and stop to feel my brain to be burned when I speak with mobile phone and with the other products that I use I feel the diference. We are not all the people with the same sensitive to leave ourselves to feel because the logic mind is to big. I hope to see my mesage also in your website. Thanks a lot.
June 22nd, 2008 at 2:37 pm
I am 63 years old, french and live in America for the last 30 years I am always sceptical on miraculous cures and I only beleive what I see , touch and experiment again an again. I did experiment on my aging father 93 years old without his knowledge I placed tachion beads in his pocket. He went down the 3rd floor where he lived to go shoping and suddenly as he was walking in the street, beside me, he realized he forgot his cane!!!! He could not walk without his cane for years! (He was actually walking almost normally but I did not say nothing, waiting for his reaction!) He was tempted to goback home and said: “” what a hell!!! I do not need it!..”". I did experiment on people when some where aware of it and it might have affected their reaction, who knows!so that did not convice me totally. I wanted more… I tried it on my 15 years old dog after he became paralyzed in his back Legs…. he did not know what I was doing… his energy level went up very fast, you could see it in his eyes. he was like rejuvenated and guess what… he was able to get up on his four legs and make few steps….and he walked again! I will not say that he became a young puppy but that was achieved in 2 days after I applied the beads. I am an intelligent person but an ignorant in these things. I am not a scientist, I am not a beleiver of anything until I really convince myself it works and it is real. Who cares about the words the salesmen are using…I don’t even beleive in salesmaen, as you said it is mostly bullshit.and as you say some of them may be selling fake one. The one I had 18 years ago worked! and before you go into conclusion that this is all bullshit, mr super intelligent “knows-it-all” why don’t you do what I did: experiment and experiment again and again. May be you will be conviced that it works like I did ! My brother inlaw is a professional healer in France. He did not know about the tachyon beads. When I went to visit him I had few in my pocket> He said hello to his sister,(my wife), then shacked my hand. He opened his eyes wide in disbeleif…I asked him what is the matter? he said: “”your energy level is so high it is unbeleivable! What did you do? “”
he wanted to know more… he sensed an energy level higher than all professionals.. without saying anything I put the beads in his hands telling him this is a gift for you! He was touching them in awe, feeling the power of it!!! He could see that my car was “supercharged” with this energy and I was able to drive across france for 1600 km without fatigue of anykind. present in the car was also my aging mother inlaw who got an umbeleivable energy during the whole trip, despite being sitting in a small car for hours… She never experience back pain and was walking like a mouse beside us despite her great age… I you know what ? I became a beleiver after years of experiment, and even more : I am now able to heal people whith Reiki if you ever know what is is (you should, since you know everything) and the beads help me even more. May be I should call it ” Universal Life Force” I don’t care if you don’t beleive it but it works!!! So please stop your ” Bullshit ” (to use your favorite word ) and experiment yourself, because right now, you look like the french mascot: a rooster singing on a pile of shit! “cock-a-doodle-do ”’….
June 26th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
Hello Pierre,
I’m not sure why you’re so offended by my article on Tachyon energy. I meant no disrespect to you personally. The people for whom I have zero respect are those who knowingly deceive gullible and impressionable people into purchasing items that do absolutely nothing.
Your stories are very touching, but unfortunately they have not made me think twice about my conclusions, because I’ve heard all these stories before. Unlike you, I’ve researched all the facts, read plenty of medical journals, and heard just about every claim from fanatical New-Age believers. The human mind is a powerful thing, and even the most intelligent people can succumb to irrational beliefs if they allow their mind to stray from rigorous scientific reasoning.
Tachyon beads are not tested by scientists because testing them would be a waste of time. In order to test them, we would need to know what is special about them (how are they different from ordinary non-tachyonized beads). This is something that the Tachyon companies refuse to tell us. The reason for this is that there is nothing special about them!
The fact that you practice Reiki tells me that you already have a predisposition towards irrational beliefs, so it’s no wonder that tachyon beads fit right into your philosophy. If you honestly believe that tachyon beads have magical powers, then you can’t call yourself a “skeptic.” If you have at least a rudimentary scientific training, you should realize that letting your friends and family try the tachyon beads doesn’t constitute an “experiment.”
Let me offer this final observation: You claim that tachyon beads helped your father walk down the stairs without a cane. My claim is much more simple: your father experienced memory loss because of his old age, and therefore forgot his cane. Which one of us is right? Naturally you’ll prefer your interpretation, because that’s the one that makes you feel good inside. Unfortunately that’s not the way science works.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:05 am
I think Dmitry and others have done an admirable job in trying to explain the scientific mindset. At the very least, they’ve highlighted the differences between science and pseudoscience.
There is a critical element that the “believers” always miss. The purpose of science is to attempt to explain naturally occurring phenomena. The keyword there is attempt. It is logically impossible to really explain something. One can certainly support an explanation with evidence, but that doesn’t make it true. It is always possible, no matter how much evidence one has to back up an idea, that contradictory data exists out there somewhere. Put another way, there could always be another explanation. A proper investigation considers all possibilities, systematically trying to refute them all until only one is left that, despite best efforts, cannot be contradicted. Even then, additional explanations continue to be sought. It is a never-ending process.
So what does this have to do with Tachyon Energy? I’d be willing to wager anything those claiming to have tested ATT’s products have not properly considered all possibilities. Take Pierre for instance. He claims a correlation exists between the presence of “tachyonized” beads in a pocket and his father’s ability to walk without a cane. To be fair, such a correlation may in fact exist. There is no evidence that I am aware of in direct contradiction to this claim. However, there could still be another explanation. Some medical symptoms vary with environmental conditions such as temperature or humidity. Perhaps the conditions were favorable that day. Perhaps his father had a condition that went into spontaneous remission completely on its own. There are many ways to explain the observations. It is irresponsible of Pierre to credit the beads until ALL other options have been exhausted.
As for Sam, regardless of his background and claims, he does not appear to behave in a manner consistent with the philosophies scientific community. His hostility at the notion of sharing his results as well as the ad hominem attacks makes me question his credibility. I am reviewing the page he linked, however.
I will finish here with a simple question for anyone who buys into this sort of pseudoscientific marketing. ATT claims they can endow everyday objects with the ability to provide significant healing and to do so very inexpensively and reliably. If this is true, why haven’t they won a Nobel Prize?
July 4th, 2008 at 5:06 am
Ok, having examined the link Sam provided as well as reviewing his posts here, I have a couple of problems. First of all, he does not say much about his controls. The presence or absence of beads under a petri dish is not the only independent variable in the experiment. What about solution volume? Concentration? Temperature? If the “control” dish was not resting on top of beads, what was it resting on? There are too many basic procedural questions that Sam has not answered. As a scientist, Sam should know that it is his responsibility to do so.
Second, his argument that nobody here has “falsified the tachyon claims” is flawed. For any given claim, the burden of proof rests squarely with the claimant. In this case, ATT has made certain claims and thus it is their obligation to support those claims with objective, testable evidence for others to review. Once again, as a scientist, Sam should know this.
July 5th, 2008 at 1:43 pm
After reading eveyones comments, it appears that the argument is scientific proof against non scientific proof. We all know that scientific experimentation is not an absolute. It all depends on the experimenter and their methods. Just because we can not prove something through experimentation does not mean that it does not exist. All the scientists thought Einstein was a fool, but in time they discovered he was right and it changed the way people perceived the nature of life. Unfortunately our brains are finite and cannot comprehend the infinite. Why discredit something that cannot be measured because we don’t have the instruments to do it. There are always going to be people who think inside the box and therefore cannot conceive of anything that does not fit into their little box. Maybe this tachyon is to big for your little box and therefore it does not exist. There seems to be a lot of people who are getting help from it in many different ways. If I had my choice I would rather spend my money on something that has a positive effect on humanity than creating negativity and wasting time trying to discredit other peoples beliefs and how they choose to spend their money. Maybe Dmitry should set up a meeting with the inventor of tachyon products and at least understand what he is talking about. Then maybe he would be able to make an informed decision. Just to read a bunch of material is’nt always the best scientific approch. Just for your information I believe you left out the part about tachyon products that states the products are antenae that attract the energy so it can have an effect on the bodies own energetic healing system. If you have studied acpuncture or any other form of natural healing you know it is based on stimulating the bodies own ability to heal itself. There are thousands of people who have received benefits from non medical, non scientific methods of healing. Most scientists deny that we are a part of nature and are subject to natural laws and that when we live our life outside of natural laws we suffer from illness. By the way I have never used the tachyon products but I am going to waste my money on some and see for myself.
July 6th, 2008 at 1:54 am
Rupert,
There is a common misunderstanding about science held by the general public, and with all due respect, it would appear you share it. While you are correct that science is not absolute, it does not claim to be. The community freely admits that everything it accepts as “true” may in reality be utter nonsense. In fact, this is a fundamental requirement. No idea is accepted unless it is capable of being wrong. This prevents unfounded claims such as the universe having been created by the Flying Spaghetti Monster after a night of heavy drinking. By demanding that one admit the possibility of being incorrect, it forces them to show cause why they are not incorrect. You will note that I did not say it forces them to show cause why they are right. There is a difference between being right and being not wrong. The former says that something is, whereas the latter says it may or may not be. This grey area is where science exists — in the realm of possibility that lies between truth and falsehood.
You made mention of Einstein and the ridicule he endured for his novel ideas. Just because someone claims to be a scientist does not mean they always act in a scientific fashion. They’re human beings too. Anyone who rejects an idea simply because they don’t like it is a bigot, regardless of their qualifications. An idea should only be considered for rejection if it contradicts observation.
As for ATT, their ideas are not being completely rejected. We’re not saying they’re wrong. Rather, we’re asking them to show cause why they are not wrong. Thus far they have failed to do so.
July 7th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
Rupert:
I challenge you to find a single scientist who denies that humans are a part of nature.
July 28th, 2008 at 7:45 pm
As an aside, I grew up in the town where ATT is established, and I’ve known people who worked for the company. Of the anecdotes I’ve heard, the consistent elements are as follows:
Within ATT’s headquarters there is a room with a machine. Only two people (David Wagner and his son) are allowed into this room and thus only they have ever seen the device. Any object can be “tachyonized” by undergoing processing. The nature of this processing is a closely-guarded secret, the stated reason for which is that the technology is too revolutionary to trust that others will use it properly.
Ignoring for a moment the textbook pseudoscience, ATT’s address of record is located within your typical light-industrial park, so common of many small-businesses in suburban California. It is an older park (circa late 70s or early 80s) and is in a low-to-mid income area of the city. It is by no means an area of high-value or high-security. That said, if the technology were really as revolutionary as is claimed, people would be trying to steal it on a regular basis. Protection of the technology would be of primary concern. The thing is, there are far more secure places in the same town housing things of assumedly less value. This would seem to suggest that ATT is not concerned about the theft of their secrets. Why not?
August 3rd, 2008 at 7:40 pm
i happened upon your website by accident as i was researching the tachyonization process. i believe the problem with many of the questions and certainly your replies is a lack of up to date undertanding of current research being done on the unified field theory in places often outside the united states. might i refer you specifically to the physics of burkhard heim (died 1986) where he postulates that the physical world is made up primarily of 6 dimensions not the conventional 4 (length, width, height and time). the next two dimensions are called (by him) the entelechial dimension. these dimensions are where the etheric stuff of the universe is created by forces like himan thought into physical reality. besides the calculations necessary to explain his theory he had to develop a new math (metron calculus) to more precisely describe his hypothesis. interestingly, the predictive results have been quite good (to the 4th decimal place or better in many cases). in this world, what you believe is often what you get, since you create reality by thought before it is stabilized in 4th dimensional reality. actually, students of quantum mechanics have observed this phenomenon for decades. so, in the final analysis, assuming the late dr. heim is correct. all of you are right. the skeptics, such as yourself can justifiably continue your skepticism. the optimists, who honestly observe these new phenomenon can continue with their. and the guru’s such as the amazing randi, can keep their million dollar prize, knowing without doubt that there is nothing beyond their ability to see, touch and reproduce.
August 4th, 2008 at 1:10 am
I am not aware of James Randi ever having claimed there was nothing beyond the ability to see, touch, and reproduce. That is in fact a very unscientific view. Would you mind citing this?
August 16th, 2008 at 1:06 am
I bought one of the ATT 4-inch Tachyonized Silica Disks. When it first came in my mail, I thought I noticed it feeling strange on my left hand but not my right hand (my left hand has injury), it felt sort of like a strong magnetic field feels. But, later, I could not feel this anymore, so I am not sure if it was just something other than the disk. I tried the disk on my water, I tried it with decaying bananas, I tried it with freshly cut flowers, I put it on my own body on an injured area for a few nights. I can’t get any kind of noticeable result with it. Can anyone suggest any other tests to do?
August 16th, 2008 at 6:55 am
@ThirtySomething
If you’re finding yourself unable to reproduce the effects you initially felt on your left hand, it would suggest something other than the disk. As for different tests to try, there’s not really anything I can think of that would yield meaningful results. ATTI refuses to tell anybody exactly what these things are supposed to do — everything they say is rather vague and ambiguous. As such, it’s impossible to know what one should even test for let alone how to go about it.
August 18th, 2008 at 12:26 pm
ThirtySomething,
As Milo pointed out, ATTI is extremely vague about what the disks are actually supposed to do. This is done deliberately, so that they can weasel out of being accountable for any failed tests. If you perform a test, and it fails, they can simply say, “we never claimed that the disks can do that…”
I should also add that any meaningful experiment with these disks should involve much more than one disk! (e.g. what if the disk you have is “broken” in some way?)
You would need at least ten disks (for ten identical test setups), as well as ten placebo disks (disks that look identical to the real ones, but haven’t gone through the Tachyonization process).
And of course, the person responsible for setting up the 20 test stations would need to be blinded (not told which disks are real or placebo).
Then, and only then, will actual science take place.
September 13th, 2008 at 6:22 pm
According to one Mr. Gerry Wolke:
“On a quiet, peaceful evening during the summer of 1993, an inventor was driving his electric blue sportscar through the beautiful streets of Santa Rosa, California, a clean, upscale community of 100,000 residents about 50 miles north of San Francisco. His wife had jokingly told him that the fast car would probably kill him. He, on the other hand, credits it with saving his life.
That evening without warning someone in a rented car, so the police said, pulled up beside his car and attempted to blast him with a shotgun. Fortunately, the man was not hurt but his car will definitely have an “autobody” experience. The reason he is still alive is that he had placed a huge crystal in the passenger seat of his car with the intention of using it, ironically, at a peace meditation. The gun blast hit the crystal instead. This man has no known enemies and Santa Rosa is not Florida. The identity of the attacker and the reason for the attack are not known. The man says that he knows who is responsible but won’t say who it is. There are, however, suspicions. He says this isn’t the first time he’s seen them, that his attackers often follow him hoping to find the location of his laboratory. I guess if you can’t join ‘em, beat ‘em.”
This is an excerpt of information about tachyon products and David Wagner. What I want to know is that if the above tale is true, why is Wagner not in jail for obstruction of justice?
November 5th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
After reading all these comments, I find it very interesting that the people defending Tachyon beads, plates and additional nonsense present the most untolerable and rude attitude in their defense. So much for “spiritual and mental well being”. I think you should be investing more time in interpersonal and personal relationship skills and less time on glass toys.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:45 am
Stumbled onto this site when my girlfriend started spouting about Tachyon products. DmitryBrant whomsoever you are I am now beholden to you! Agree wholeheartedly with everything. I’m also absolutely blown away by the fact that people are actually trying to prove that there is scientific basis for this bile. Keep up the good work.
November 20th, 2008 at 11:50 am
Just read through some of Sam’s comments…..suspect he/she may be related to Sara Palin and her supporters….
November 29th, 2008 at 6:51 pm
I actually had a very good friend who used the “tachyonized” silica disks in meditation. He even at one point traveled to California to attend an ATT workshop called “Vertical Reality 101.” In that workshop they teach you “energy clearing” techniques to use with a product they make called a “vortex pendant”. The pendant is a cut crystal (quartz?) and undergoes the “tachyonization” process. My friend claimed that he found out some information about the tachyonization process. He said it involves storing the material to be “tachyonized” in a vacuum chamber for 2 weeks. Perhaps this is the machine that Milo spoke of? I am obviously quite skeptical. I know nothing about vacuum chambers, or how that even relates to what ATT claims to be able to do with “tachyons”. Sorry if this information is making more people want to vomit.
December 2nd, 2008 at 2:04 pm
Tom,
Thanks for that bit of insight. Regarding vacuum chambers, there’s nothing special about them per se. It’s a chamber… that’s had all the air pumped out of it. How would storing materials in a vacuum cause them to become “tachyonized”? By that logic, the whole planet should be tachyonized since it’s been in a vacuum for 4.5 billion years!
January 6th, 2009 at 3:34 am
Interesting posts. Over the years I have bought gizmo’s that have not passed the empirical scientific review. One has been tachyon products. In 1999 I was sitting on the sofa with my legs under me. Not realizing they were numb and as I took a few steps to the next room I fell and hit my knee on a closed door. My husband came running and helped me to see a half dollar size bright purple bruise on my knee. Limping to bathroom for an ace bandage, I put a 75mm tachyon cell on the bruise and wrapped the bandage around it. I retired to the lounge chair for a couple hours to read and stay off my leg. I unwrapped the bandage to check the bruise and it was gone. I called my husband who was speechless as he always calls my gizmo’s ‘the wife’s voodoo’. Being his degrees are in chemistry and math he accepts little without the empirical documentation. However, it is hard to doubt your own experience. We went to Santa Rosa and took David Wagner’s courses on tachyon and have used many products as well as practitioner tools not available to those who have not taken the courses. Many is the time these tools have relieved pain within ten minutes and of course, there is no way to prove they speed up the healing process to anyone who has not used them. I have only my experience. For sure, if I could not get anymore tachyon tools I would not part with mine for all the money in the world.
January 6th, 2009 at 7:26 am
Dar,
Fascinating stuff; so you’re saying that you believe the bruise wouldn’t have gone away as quickly if the tachyon cell wasn’t there? So theoretically we can set up a double-blind test where 100 bruise victims apply “cells” to their bruises, some cells tachyonized, some cells not, and observe the results.
But then you say:
Surely you can see how that’s the nail in the coffin of your testimonial. If you’re admitting that the effect of the tachyon cells is completely subjective, you’re admitting to using placebo.
January 6th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
DB,
You are a hoot! Pardon a greatgrandmother for using that expression. Often we see the old placebo effect explanation as the answer to many things we cannot explain in ordinary science. It in itself as a belief system as the placebo effect is looked at closely, this is saying your belief has healed you, so shut up. Think about it, if your belief can heal you where does that stand with science? An interesting book is “The Biology of Belief” by Bruce Lipton might give you some ideas. (He has an science research background.) When I put the tachyon bars on my grandbaby’s tummy and he quits crying I’ll be sure and tell him about the placebo effect. Open up DB, there are things not covered by science as we know it.